22 MAy 2004 - Excerpt of Bar complaint:

Rule 4.8.4 c is:

(c) Engage in conduct involving dishonesty, fraud, deceit or misrepresentation. 

and 

4.8.4.d 

(d) Engage in conduct in connection with the practice of law that is prejudicial to the administration of justice. including to knowingly or in callous indifference, disparage, humiliate, or discriminate against litigants, jurors, witnesses or court personnel, on any basis...

And it is my sincere opinion, that Ms. Shirly Wilson has been being used by Ms Patricia Greenway to accomplish the above. While being egged on by Scientology OSA's U-Mike and other flakes to attack me and those who dare believe that Bob minton is telling the truth.

See PDF File of Bar complaint at Florida Supreme Court

http://www.lermanet2.com/scientologylegal/mcpherson011203.htm

Judge Shaeffer:

"It is impossible to read the briefs and attachments of the opposing lawyers in this case and get the total testimony, regarding this or any other issue involved in this hearing. The lawyers involved in this case are advocates,, and as such, point out the testimony, etc. that furthers their position. Neither side, includes all the testimony necessary to resolve this very controverted issue. " http://www.lermanet2.com/scientologylegal/mcpherson100202.htm

Shaeffer:" "The Defendants discuss what the Plaintiffs’ experts stated in their depositions and affidavits to attempt to establish that the Plaintiff can prove no issue of intentional wrongdoing. They artfully pick and choose their passages from the depositions."

Arnie's Comment: The defendants arn't the only ones who "artfully pick and choose their passages from the depositions"

Shaeffer:"Who is telling the truth is not a question of law, but a fact for the jury. "

Tigger: "So if it was so important for Patricia to testify, why didn't Minton or COS call her? "

Because bob was NOT a named party in that action, he could not call witnesses, he was a witness in that action that was being nailed for perjury, in that particular action, in which Patricia could not muster the courage that Bob had demonstrated for hundreds of hours... to testify under oath and she backed out, refusing to take the stand, and now chats up tigger behind the scenes to keep her spun up, which is good for scientology.

And it sure sounds like a cheaper way for Scientology to take over "the critic movement" than it demonstrated, as a pattern of conduct, in taking over the Cult Awareness Network.

Take over the money for the anti-cult group.. before it gets organized...after destroying the main competitor - The LMT, which, if it existed, and had not been systematically destroyed, might have gained the fianncing needed to survive from the same distribution from the Lisa Mcpherson settlement, that certain other partys now aspire to, behind the scenes, while keeping the easily manipulated, spun up, over footprints in the sand.

The same person that attacked all three successive "Leaders" of the LMT, David Cecere, Stacy Brooks, Bob Minton, now seeks to gain access to that distribution.

Thats whats going on, of course thats just my opinion...and if somebody doesn't like it, get over it, that opinion is based upon observed conduct by a person about whome there is no background information, who claimed to have gotten involved in this fracas originally by meeting another prominent ex member in an aol singles chatroom?

And if not successful, the effort at least, wastes tiggers time, and wastes my time.

Tigger should ask patricia when was the last time that she asked Bob Minton for money...

Dear Tigger,

I am still convinced you are being used...manipulated, by those who hope to gain favor of largesse from any McPherson cash settlement.

Arnie Lerma

Tigger sez: "Arnie, stop doing OSA's work. It's time to take down your "wild speculations". Tigger "

Dear Tigger,

No tigger, it is you who has publicized a page that I didn't even have linked from any of the 6788 .htm pages on my website!!

Nice job! Well Done! Take a bow!

Look in a mirror.

Posted on Saturday, May 01, 2004 - 1:56 pm:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When bob percieved that he was running out of choices, was around the time that Moxon was running the criminal prosecution before Judge Shaeffer for criminal perjury.

That case has not been webbed nor discussed

When Moxon rested his case, Bob's lawyer asked for dismissal, because criminal perjury convictions demand that a "witness" affidavit be filed in support of the charges. This is a stutory requirment for conviction for criminal perjury. Moxon screwed up...

This was not done.

And bob escaped on a technicallity.

This was Bob's epiphany.

For bob to get convicted of a felony - would make him unable to work - as an investment banker.

Bob called me before his recant. and explained the situation. Which was entirly consistent with his testimony to follow.

I told Bob that it was so very unfortunate, but I understood he was running out of choices. And he was being driven mad by hundreds of hours on the stand and in depositions while those who aspired to replace him pummeled the LMT and all who dared support him psychologically.

And this is what I told Mr. Minton. That

"as long as you are telling God's truth you have my blessing."

re Dandar, I have explained to Ken what my opinions are, as, in my opinion, one cannot win against scientology using lies, especially when the truth will suffice.

The current "truth" is that Luke Lirot is the Attorney of record in the Lisa Mcpherson case, Dandar, having been removed as unreliable.

There is notably no mention of the unsealing of Dandar's deposition in the Federal case before Judge Kovachavich.

Despite my own disdain for Mr Dandar etc, I have continued to support his efforts to nail scientology by providing him with information regarding Scientology's conduct and history that would be germaine to winning the case, esppecially those tidbits that he overlooks. And he has overlooked a lot.

this while trying to protect my freind Bob Minton, who, unlike so many, entered this fray while having a lot to lose.

none of the vitriolic attackers have ever been in front of the scientology litigation big guns. Looking down those double barrels...

I have

of the symptoms of both scientology, evil, and psychosis, is a lack of compassion.

Some, with meagre abilities, or other agendas, would rant endlessly, over and over again, about things they think they understand..

The web pages Tigger mischaracterizes with off colour thread titles were a response to tiggers thousands of posts.

And it has been ironically pleasing to have watched Tigger publicize an unlinked page for me so effectively.

Thank you tigger.

Sincerely

Arnie Lerma

Arnie on NBC Dateline Show: "All this litigation has been about is the pursuit of silence"

Joe Cisar's report re Bob Minton HERE (offsite)

Bob Minton Sues makers of the Profit { Peter Alexander and Patricia Greenway }

Updates at bottom of article - most recent 1 August 02

Additional rant page one

Attempt at a humorous education by parody here.

If you call a lawyer a scumbag you are likely correct by simple odds..

Theres a lot more going on in the McPherson case than the one-side-of-the-coin-as-portrayed by dandar to patrica to tigger and her buddys.

The other side of the coin?

What if Bob Minton is telling the truth?

Bob thought Dandar was an ethical guy... Bob got a lot of bad advice from 'lawyers'including Dandar. So much bad advice that bob ended up in two crimnal cases, one in Baird and expecting one before Shaeffer - for Criminal Perjury - yeah, facing jail time...

L Ron Hubbard said that only criminals attack scientology. (see Rich Leiby's Christmas Day Article in the Washington Post: http://www.lermanet2.com/cos/lerma.html When Leiby wrote this, I had no idea that he knew better than even I, exactly what I was getting myself into.. when i started scanning and posting court records in 1994)
OSA's job is to make it so. I have been extremely fortunate... Scientology has tried these things even with me.

They succeeded in turning a wise-crack followup to a posting on ars that Kieth henson made into a criminal conviction.

They took another post mentioning 79 year old Ida camburn into a threat, and produced the posting to cause the local sheriff to visit her to inquire just what was she baking inside her snickerdoodles.
see: http://www.lermanet2.com/scientologyscandals/keepoffmomsfrontporch.htm

So we KNOW Scientology wants to make all critics into criminals, and bob minton was #1..
Bob bailed me out financially after the brutal litigation of RTC vs Lerma..

Dandar/Greenway/Tigger et all shreik that BOB CUT A DEAL...

Well... Bob does have a confidentiality agreement to not disclose pre-settlement negotiations... thats all... BOB IS STILL A NAMED PARTY BEING SUED BY SCIENTOLOGY in the BREACH case.

What is the Breach case? Didn't tigger mention this?

Ken Dandar SIGNED a secret agreement with Scientology - HE CONTRACTED WITH MIKE RINDER's organiztion.. in writing..HE did this LONG ago.. and agreed to not try to name or sue and of the executives or borard memebers or other organizations other than Flag Ship Organization..
in exchange for that, FSO agreed that they would not strip assets, or create a shell, to make any judgement uncollectable { eg.. do what they did to Wollersheim )

Ken Dandar BREACHED this aggreement. They won a case on it in texas and have a judgement for 500,000 against Ken and a pronouncement of him as a vexatious litigator... They won a separate summary judgement for this breach of contract in Shaeffers court, and all thats left for a jury to determine is the DAMAGE award.. which might go 5-10 million. I believe the attorney fees are already awarded. 300 grand... 10 + .3 + .5 = 11.3

Scientology is moving to collect on those judgements NOW...

Ken Dandar has totally screwed himself.

Even *IF* he gets a big award from a jury... the first 6-11 million go right back to the cult for the BREACH case..

If he gets a big award from a jury AND its more than 6-11 million, he needs 2 million more to pay bob minton back. And Bob will get it back, - how long would you be willing to deal with someone who was using your money to call you a liar?

So, lets say Dandar gets a 20 million Award for a wrongful death case... Historically, Wrongful Death cases happen all the time in Florida. I mean, old folks, move there... to get old and then they die.

Lots of claims are made....they do not often have a history of awards for millions of dollars, much less often ten million...

Dandar needs ten million to break even!

Using judgements for court costs and the like, and bankruptcy proceedings...Scientology's Kendrick moxon appeared at ex OT 8 Michael Pattinson's door to take the paintings off his wall, to satisfy a judgement...

They filed a motion to seize Gerry armstrongs BICYCLE!

So.. what do you think might happen to Dell Librech's home... while Scientology has judgements to execute for collection IN their hand now...AND { drum roll ) at BEST, Ken dandar will be holding the title and deed to property that is mortgaged to 100% of its value? [ because of his own BREACH of contract !!? ]

Who really cut a deal with Scientology?

Where are the Threads and drum beating of "Dandar cut a deal"

OK So now you have a glimpse of what the other side of the coin looks like.

Lets see what the coin flip says when the judges rule...

Arnie Lerma


PS: I'm not a lawyer, but Ive fired more of them in the war for truth than anyone else besides my friend Bob Minton and my friend Lawrence Wollersheim.

More rants like this here:
http://www.lermanet2.com/reference/postedapril20.htm

Harassment timeline for bob minton - while reading this ask youself how long would you last?
http://www.lermanet2.com/reference/Law_enforcement_Breif/Harassment_IW.doc { Word document )

Tigger, et all have never been deposed, sued, or on the stand. Ms Greenway, tigger's 'source' once put herself on the witness list but chickened out.
Anyone wonder why?

Absolutely Wild Speculations  [ from time to time as information comes to my attention this page will be edited ]

I'm still convinced bob Minton is telling the truth

But there is more going on here...

You see Dandar can't just decide, after bob's testimony , yeah that's what happened.... and say bob's telling the truth.... and get off with a wrist slap, as an officer of the court, he is held to a higher standard.... I'm still assuming bob's telling the truth, which might be a clue to what's taking Dandar so long to get back into court,  perhaps he needs more time before he brings on his witnesses... to rehearse and get their stories straight

And why is Patricia greenway involved at all? What's her motive for frying bob?

Some production cost estimates for TFC's movie The Profit, range from $100 grand to not more that 500, 000
- that would leave TFC and Peter with a cool million each...

Where did it go and what is it for?

The threat of finding out those answers might be a motive to set bob up for the current charges,
in hopes the cult and/or  the stress would kill him... rather than have him credible and  able to sue for fraud.

Dandar's only defense is to assert bob is lying...  while patricia's cronies cloud   the air up with "he cut a deal'

Perhaps it is part of some some elaborate scheme, Bob Minton's own personal version of the movie "the Sting?"

Only I call it The Profit - The Sequel

That is, scam the dough from bob and then use the cult to destroy bob so there's no possibility he will figure our what's going on in time before he is "destroyed utterly" and thusly no risk of his being capable to sue them into the poor house for what might be a simple "conspiracy to defraud" ?

Motive? The profit.

What if Ken doesn't even intend to continue to practice law any more anyway?

What the hell does a 2 man law firm need 60,000 square feet of warehouse space for?

Why did Patricia Greenway stop publicly posting to the net.. and working exclusively through side kicks Deanna, tiger et all or anonymously - Approx May 2001 -

Did she do this when she concocted the current scheme? - which I call "The Profit - The Sequel" so there would be no 'evidence' because she knew she was up to no good?

And did not the Teresa Somers fiasco occur the day after she went to dinner with Patricia? May-June 2001?

Are they using the cult to destroy bob, having set him up for the perjury charges, so he cannot seek restitution from them, and Ken and Patricia will live happily ever after?

Where the hell did ken Dandar come from?

Where the hell did Patricia greenway come from?

Did Patricia Greenway really meet peter Alexander in an internet singles chatroom?

Oh I get it, Is it possible that Patricia greenway is Bob Minton's Lavenda VanShaick who had such gifts of persuasive manipulation that she was able to convince my own girlfriend that I was a Scientologist named "arte maron" and then abscond with her and spend all of her retirement money? And it was Patricia that I was working for out of town, when my computer was stolen from my hotel room, Patricia knew where I was staying...the loss of the computer stopped me from chatting with Dennis Erlich while he was in settlement talks..

I wonder what it would be like if Patricia had never come on the scene?

I bet the CAN people are asking the same question about "Laura Terrapin"....

Of course this is just wild speculation,

Arnie Lerma

If you want the truth follow the money.

The oldest con game in the book - it's called The Spanish Prisoner

I described what was going on to lawyer friend here, and he laughed.

Said.. Jeez bob should have had a better lawyer...
he is being conned using the oldest con game in the book of scams...
it's called The Spanish Prisoner

There is a man held in a dark dungeon in a Spanish prison.
He has tons of money hidden somewhere

I am his friend, he will talk to me, but I need to bribe the guards.

It will take lots of money to bribe the guards...
If you give me the money to bribe the guards, Ill find out where the loot is.

But, because I'm using your money to bribe the guards you must never admit that you gave me the money if anyone ever asks you, OK?

You agree.

When questioned about what this guy is up to you tell the cops, that you didn't give him any money...

Later, when you realize you have been conned you complain, and the cops say, well, are you lying now or were you lying then?

This is the one of the worlds oldest con games.

This is why Lirot, if bob is telling the truth, I'm afraid, will NOT try to break the non disclosure agreement...
because the only chance of getting away with it, is by not breaking the non-disclosure, bob will be assumed to have motive to lie.

It is the only way ken has to cast doubt on bob's testimony

If bob is lying through his teeth, then breaking the gag, and revealing the alleged dark secrets underneath... will prove motive to lie. but if bobs not lying, will prove veracity of statements.

So if Lirot doesn't attack the non disclosure, then perhaps he knows his client is full of shit.

If Ken Dandar is trying to avoid going back into hearing - maybe he needs more time to get his 'witnesses' stories straight...

And regarding the Spanish Prisoner con, if my lawyer saw this  in under ten minutes, how long do you think it took Judge Baird?

Of course, this is just more absolutely wild speculation, like my previous post..

28 April 02 In Message-ID: Xns91FE54F7B6863mirelesonicnet@208.201.224.154
Deana Holmes the most virulent longtime attacker of Bob Minton on the net admits that Ken Dandar
told her to stop posting about Bob, so he would send him the last check for $250 grand!
The message was delivered through a '3rd party" wonder who that was... This would be one of the checks
that Dandar swore under oath was from an anonymous source"

During one of the hearings a check was produced, as an exhibit, it was blown up really large, it was payable to Courage Productions - That's Patricia Greenway and Peter Alexander's outfit that made the Profit ... Page 184 of April 30 hearing The check was from the same account and bank as the checks that Dandar said were from one of bob's friends....- then we learned shortly after this that Patricia Greenway asked to be withdrawn as a witness for Dandar.

8 may - Stacy on the stand all day 13 hours so far Patricia greenway is passing notes to Dandar's attorney, lirot at least 50+ of them with questions to embarrass Stacy

12 May 2002 - Ok, lets just look at the money in the McPherson case...   there was mention in the transcripts of something Judge Shaeffer said some weeks prior, that the case wasn't worth any more than 500K from a jury.  And this was before the Ken Dandar inspired lies and cover-up were revealed by Bob Minton.

Case liabilities: [ liabilities of THE ESTATE and DELL LIBRECH ]

300-400K in sanctions due to discovery issues and lies and cover-up.
~500K in recoverable attorney fees by the cult   
5-10 MILLION possible judgement and attorney fees for Breach of Contract* by Ken Dandar and the Estate for the cult

Estimate of total potential liabilities : SIX to ELEVEN MILLION DOLLARS

*There was a prior secret agreement by Ken Dandar with the cult to NOT add directors of Scientology to the lawsuit, which was breached by Ken Dandar's amended complaint that added David Miscavige...

Potential Recovery:

500,000 !  said one of Judges in the case. [ BEFORE the current revelations ] - Ken Dandar has lost most of the case already, he lost wrongful imprisonment, he   cant even introduce the roach bite evidence.... he has a simple accidental death case...

so....   If McPherson case goes forward - Dell Librech could end up 5.5 to 10.5 million in the hole.

The Ken Dandar  / Patricia Greenway / Deanna Holmes / Tigger spin is that "BOB SOLD OUT"

In my opinion, Bob Minton was trying to make sure that Dell Librech did not lose the trailer she calls her home......

Arnie Lerma

163 [ Q - is judge shaeffer A= stacy ]

6 Q I'll bet you were.

28 May 2002

    After reading stacy's 29 April affidavit, there was one line of it that contains an obvious [ to me ] error..

    I took the time to mention this to stacy, and mentioned it here on ARS..

    Paragraph 18 was corrected by a filing dated 6 May to read:

"The final portion of paragraph eighteen should read: Mr. Minton put Keith henson on the advisory board after funding his litigation with scientology, and he also provided funds to help support Arnie Lerma while Mr. Lerma was in litigation with Scientology. Mr. Minton put Mr. Liepold and Mr. Dandar on the Advsory board as the two main Scientology litigators he was funding."


    Of course... factual errors or misstatements just railed about on this newsgroup won't get you too far, I did take the time to let Stacy know something that I had personal knowledge of was in fact not the way it was put on paper.

    I doubt Patricia Greenway or her clones Deanna or Tigger would have ever mentioned this, as this demonstrated willingness to correct factual errors does not suit Patricia Greenway's intent.. which was, in the very beginning of LMT to take control of the LMT from Stacy and Bob., when that failed, it became to destroy the LMT through destroying Stacy and Bob Minton behind their backs ...while apparently successfully fleecing Bob Minton for a couple million dollars for the abysmal movie "THE PROFIT".

    Patricia C. Greenway may now be presenting herself to her flock, as the one to become the head of a new anti-cult group, that Dandar and Dell may have agreed to fund with proceeds from the claimed '50-80 million" dollars sized carrot, the claimed recovery amount that Lisa McPherson's death is 'worth', that the Clearwater Branch Dandarians brandish on every occasion, despite fact that one of the judges said they thought he'd get no more than 500,000...for what was left of the case whose condition now is that of an errant garbage scow.

Arnie Lerma

"After we run Bob out of money, we will come after you" said Scientology's OSA PR lady Sylvia Stanard in Washington DC
to myself and Lisa Gibson in front of the French Embassy on reservoir road.2 years ago

Scientology's plan is to erase all memory of the existence of the LMT. The name will not be mentioned. It never existed and there was never proof there were no OTs in Scientology right there on Ft Harrisson avenue.

Now, given my view, that all Bob decided to do was to tell the truth. You can now rail, squeal and quack about how arnie was deceived....

The fact remains, that, though the truth might hurt a man named ken Dandar, the acts committed trying to "make the lisa case go right" were greedy if not just stupid.

If the truth bothers the sordid array of players and their dupes left as true believers that Ken Dandar and his side kicks can do no wrong, and if he did, Thou Shalt Not Mention It for the sake of a dead young lady in clearwater.

Now, if Bob only agreed to tell the truth... and the truth might hurt Savior Dandar's case, then the right thing to do would be to try to induce Bob Minton to suicide.

Inducement to suicide would attain what scientology has in fact failed to attain... a state called "Bob Sold Out"

This would also, help erase all memory of LMT for Mike Rinder... and most importantly, set the stage for the new organization, run by Patricia Greenway and her hopes to get her claws into a piece of the Lisa Mc{Pherson judgment-pie-in-the-sky.

Ms. Greenway has been silent in this venue but oh so active behind the scenes, cajoling, jawboning, and leaning upon the Dalnet 'crew', masterminding the orchestration of the Bob SOLD OUT attack line, which was well done, but you guys overplayed your hand. That over-reach made it obvious to me that we dealing with an orchestrated side show production not unlike "The Sting" which I call "The Profit, Part II". Ms. Greenway, having successfully run a scam on Bob Minton to fleece him of 2 million dollars, the cheap production so aptly called "The Profit" was now hooked on dreams of the really BIG MONEY.

Deanna Holmes, Tigger (Shirley Wilson), Starshadow even Diane jumped on the opportunity, after having their own buttons expertly pushed by that master manipulator. And you were taken for the same ride.

Deana Holmes Changes Her Story:

"I most certainly did not receive money from Bob Minton;
in fact, I don't think Bob knew I was going until after I was there."

---- Deana M. Holmes - September 15, 2000

"[Somebody] thought I was a hypocrite for taking Bob and Stacy's money
for a plane ticket... Well, you know, I didn't want to go, but *Patricia Greenway*
talked me into accepting the offer."

---- Deana M. Holmes - April 23, 2002

Shirley Wilson Changes Her Story:

"I was told about Minton's offer to "donate" to the Lisa
Case IF I and Deana would shut up about the LMT, Minton, Brooks,
Bunker."
---- Shirley Wilson - April 29, 2002

"On or about Feb 17 I knew that Mr. Minton was going to have some friends
in Europe send some money to Mr. Dandar IF Deana and I would shut up
and IF Mr. Dandar would write a "suck-up" letter to Mr. Minton."

---- Shirley Wilson - August 8, 2002

To me, as long as my freind Bob Minton, having assured me that all he was going to do was tell the truth...., the effoirt of the Dalnetters was in fact an effort to try and create a self fullfilling prophecy - BOB SOLD OUT.

That effort failed...

Now, I await the announcement of the new "LMT" run by patricia Greenway, with it's webmaster {The Mark Bunker replacement - Deanna Holmes ] and its peanut gallery of hysterical historical revisionists, trying to rewrite history for Mike Rinder, while stealing the blood money of dead young girl's estate.....

Neither bob nor stacy have ever alluded to sainthood.

They are and have been just people, trying to make the best of a difficult situation.

Ms. Greenway has been trying to take control of the LMT from day one. Failing that, Bob and Stacy had to be destroyed, in order that she could get her greedy hands into proximity to the pot-of-gold judgement.. that Dell Librech had agreed, a portion of it, should goto an anti cult group.

We are just watching "THE PROFIT, the sequel.."

And like PT Barnum would say...

THE SHOW MUST GO ON!

PS: NOT ONE OF THE "BAD BOB BUNCH" has seen the movie, THE PROFIT,other than the actual Profiteers.

"Don't ever do nothing. Unexpected attacks in
the rear of the enemies front ranks work best." -L Ron Hubbard

"It takes your enemy and your friend, working together,to hurt you to the heart;
the one to slander you and the other to get the news to you."
Mark Twain- Following the Equator